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najevi Capitaine

Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Posts: 235 Location: Gold Coast (Australia)
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Posted: 11 Jul 2010 0:36 Post subject: |
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| Jean-Luc wrote: | | In the community, ACC is used for the match races when RC44 is prefered in team races. Why ? |
| admiral wrote: | The RC44 model was, if not exclusively, chosen and made with team racing in mind.
As the ACC model was made and chosen with with match racing in mind. |
Does the RC44 offer any advantage to the skipper using manual sail trim as opposed to auto sail trim? _________________ it's better to spin and fin' than to fit and quit!  |
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David_Number1 Matelot
Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 89
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Posted: 11 Jul 2010 5:00 Post subject: |
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No
In team racing I think the draw card is the tactical sailing aspect, so the rc44 is really good in that it's so easy to sail everyone is pretty well as fast as everyone else.
Match racing there is more emphasis on boat handling and getting the last 1% out of the boat, so the ACC is a good for that because it is much harder to sail really fast. |
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admiral Amiral

Joined: 27 Oct 2003 Posts: 304 Location: Nederland
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Posted: 12 Jul 2010 11:18 Post subject: |
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As far as I remember the RC44 as model was chosen because it was expected to raise enough interest. There was a lot of communication with the RC44 class organization. Boat parameters practically had to be invented, like a retractable bowsprit, big rudder, centralised mass (read manouvrabillity) etc. Then the models behavior was fitted to the RC44's real behavior (minus a lot that just could no be made to work, like backing jibs). Then compromising behavior elsewhere to compensate for stuff that could not be made to work, (like backing jib)
The ACC for example then had some automated "backing jib" function that made the boat automatically bear down from head to wind as soon as the boat speed dropped below 1 knot. (not quite desirable in team racing when stopping the boat near a mark) The RC44 was made to slow down considerably when luffing head to wind and deccelerate backwards, and given considerable acceleration to compensate. It was made to broach wildly when sailing to high with the kite up in stronger winds (where normally you'ld break the boat). Then passing lanes were widened, keeping VMG level at a broader range of courses, even across sails. Aka. code 0 at 10 Kts will still sail with better VMG at lower angle then genoa at higher angle.
Then everything was screened for playability and game play, broaching was stripped completely and downwind speed of 20 kts of wind and more was increased considerably. Perfect for teamraces in winds of 5 kts to 20 kts. and real fun for the speed and surf junkies at force 7 winds
For compatibility reasons testing was so extensive that no updates would be needed, there will be updates only with a new VSK version.
In the end the RC44 is an immense popular community build boat model,
even if everyone including me finds something to dislike about it. |
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M-1 Capitaine
Joined: 30 Oct 2005 Posts: 259 Location: Russia
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Posted: 12 Jul 2010 16:57 Post subject: |
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| admiral wrote: | As far as I remember the RC44 as model was chosen because it was expected to raise enough interest...
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Specify pls, interest has fallen to what? Due to bad ... ACC32, team races, RRS...?
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... In the end the RC44 is an immense popular community build boat model,..
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... which reminds good ACC boat in VSK3?
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... even if everyone including me finds something to dislike about it.
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Agree.  _________________ Thanks,
Mikle |
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admiral Amiral

Joined: 27 Oct 2003 Posts: 304 Location: Nederland
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Posted: 12 Jul 2010 18:53 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Specify pls, interest has fallen to what? Due to bad ... ACC32, team races, RRS...? |
Basically in vsk you can make any boat behave as you want. One could for example make a badtub behave like Volvo70.
Once it was decided that the VSK models weren't up to par when it comes to team racing, an interesting type of boat was sought that a would induce players to try it out. The real RC44 is exciting to race so interest would be high the moment the model was ready. It was and imo still is. |
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Jean-Luc Matelot
Joined: 18 Nov 2006 Posts: 114
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Posted: 17 Jul 2010 10:51 Post subject: |
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Thank all for your messages. I have understood that the RC44 was defined to approach what the models used in the real races are.
As I never sailed in real Team Races, I had no prerequisites on the boat qualities needed. I like the ACC in TR because :
1/ the tactical options have to be taken with care due to the inerty of this heavy boat. When I watched some RC44 races, I saw the boats changing their course many times with not allways serious consequences
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2/ I also think there are more faults (pens) in RC44 due to her manoeuvrability used even in the hot spots (2 length zone's marks). Umpiring such fast events would be difficult.
3/ In brief, a RC44 race equals an ACC race but with a far greater intensity which could make me mad. So I preserve my health in using the ACC , just a question of taste.
Cheers,
jiel _________________ Jean-Luc |
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JHL mousse
Joined: 06 Jun 2009 Posts: 43
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Posted: 22 Jul 2010 19:09 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | For compatibility reasons testing was so extensive that no updates would be needed, there will be updates only with a new VSK version. |
Is the RC44's slingshot feature - round a bottom mark at high speed under spi to run upwind momentarily across the stern of an upwind tacking boat so as to pen him - something that will be addressed?
I've never been on a RC44 but it seems a 44' keel boat cannot and should not behave this way; no 30' to 40' one designs I've raced on exhibit this behavior. I'd vote that the 44 shouldn't be as much of a cartoon as the Melges. It's true the ACC is a dog on bottom mark roundings but the RC44 is unrealistically hyperactive. |
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Alx mousse
Joined: 14 May 2010 Posts: 11
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Posted: 23 Jul 2010 10:21 Post subject: |
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| JHL wrote: |
I've never been on a RC44 but it seems a 44' keel boat cannot and should not behave this way; no 30' to 40' one designs I've raced on exhibit this behavior. I'd vote that the 44 shouldn't be as much of a cartoon as the Melges. It's true the ACC is a dog on bottom mark roundings but the RC44 is unrealistically hyperactive. |
I agree |
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David_Number1 Matelot
Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 89
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Posted: 25 Jul 2010 9:46 Post subject: |
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It is fun though
And it does add another skill to sailing them...
I don't mind it |
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Alx mousse
Joined: 14 May 2010 Posts: 11
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Posted: 26 Jul 2010 10:49 Post subject: |
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Sure is fun, I find myself sailing more nowadays the RC than Acc...
Ofcourse you have to comprise with the level of madness sometimes on the public RC races, which however adds up to satisfaction |
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